What's wrong with Mary Sues?
|10 min read
It's an arcticle that I wrote for my Brazilian blog, and I'm translating into English because it may concern some people. I won't say who gave me the idea to paste it here, by now, you already know. xD
What's wrong with Mary Sues?
Here, in Brazil, the term "Mary Sue" (and her male counterpart, the Gary Stu) is a reletively unknown one. And I discovered that trying to explain what a Mary Sue is can be something... complex. You know, many people try to use the classical way of conceptualization to describe a Mary Sue (i.e., people try to find things that all characters labelled Mary Sues have in common). That's a mistake. A terrible mistake.
You can pick a bunch of characters that are Mary Sues in the hands of an author, but very cool characters in the hands of others. The SAME characters. Being a scientist (I have a major in Chemistry), I decided to analyse a Mary Sue bit by bit until we can understand who is and who isn't a Mary Sue in literature.
Basically, a Mary Sue is a character that went wrong. But not in every way. Mary Sues go wrong in a very specific way. Let me create some categories of fictional characters, for didatical puporses (did you miss them?):
1 - Overpower (OP): these are the guys that, through special training or sheer luck, are extremely skilled at something. They are greatly strong and/or intelligent and/or observant, they are kung fu masters or music maestros. A OP character would be, for instance, Superman.
2 - Friends to all living things (I'm borrowing the name from TV Tropes, but I mean a different thing): they are those characters that are so nice/kind/helpful/adorable that they make friends with everyone, even if they are clumsy or not much skilled in their jobs. Sometimes, they make friends even among the enemies. Sailor Moon is a good example.
3 - Gorgeous: these characters draw attention upon themselves just by existing. They are incredibly beautiful/intelligent/rich/famous, leaving everyone dazzled. An unusual, but valid, example of this is Sherlock Holmes. He is so famous and smart that everyone around him respect and follow him without much effort (despite his eventual rudeness).
Now, people usually say that a Mary Sue is a character that have the three traits at once: she has enormous abilities, everyone is her friend and everyone falls in love with her at first sight because she is gorgeous. Other people make long checklists listing cliché traits and tell us that a Mary Sue is a character that has X cliché traits.
The thing is, a character with many clichés attached is just a cliché character, not a Mary Sue. A Disney-Princess-like character may be cliché, but she's not a Sue. AND plenty of good characters are in categories 1, 2 e 3 above. Let's take Batman. He is 1 - a master at martial arts, detection, forensic science, driving, engineering, computers, can fly a plane, has an incredible memory and a remarkable physical endurance 2 - a character that, despite being rude and impolite, sometimes, is acquainted with almost all DC Universe (good) characters, a way or another and 3 - everyone instantly love and respects him because he is BATMAN. Seriously, Batman has learned more abilities than he could in a human life. I suspect time travel.
Or let me pick Harry Potter, 1 - the chosen one, the boy who lived, the one that defeated Voldemort when he was a baby (I know, technically, it was his mother, but still), the youngest Catcher in Hogwarts, the boy who produced a Patron good enough to impress adults, the guy who defeated Voldemort once a book. 2 - a common, nice boy, that ended with all Hogwarts (except Slytherin) rooting for him, despite small quarrells here and there. 3 - always earned fame and even some good favors because of his scar and what it represents.
OK, those two are not totally in category 2 (most people in this category are girls, for some reason, but there are many guys here), but they are far from be lonely people, or guys with just a few friends and virtually no important relations, like us mortals.
The point is, it doesn't matter if you character is half-human, half-something, with great powers, great heart and an attractive face or reputation. This isn't enough to make him or her a Mary Sue.
Now, I know you are wondering: "But... But... You can't compare Batman with Lucretia Snape-Lupin Potter III. The first is a good character and the last isn't. WHAT'S WRONG, THEN?"
Two things, my friends. The line separating good characters from Mary Sues doesn't lie in superficial things or character traits. It lies in two things:
1 - Personality deepness: It doesn't matter how much (or how little) powers and positive traits you character has. If his/her personality is shallow, nothing will save him/her. The best test for Mary Sue isn't filling checklists for clichés. No, no, just give the character the Bane treatment: break his/her spine, strip him/her of all physical beauty and all supernatural powers that this character may have. Even supernatural empathy. Let's say that no one will look your character and "like him/her naturally, without being able to explain it". After all that, what's left of your character? If he/she suddenly lost powers, beauty and friends, what would he/she do? If you have no answer to that or if you say that your character would be ruined FOREVER, than, I'm sorry to say that I'm 99% sure that this character is a Mary Sue/Gary Stu of the worse kind.
I'll give you an example: Diego, one of my protagonists, always score high in MS tests. After all, he is a teenager vampire, a good musician and a skilled supernatural cop (in training). Among his abilities, he is good in hand-to-hand combat, has supernatural force, speed and regeneration, enhanced senses and is able to use a lot of gadgets. He is a talkative guy with a good sense of humour and a little touch of smugness - not enough to make him unbearable, just the right measure to make people laugh. He makes friends easily, since he is everything but shy, and he is handsome, which make him a chic magnet. Beneath all this mask of self-assurance, he is a good guy, with geek tendencies and a great need for approval, specially from his mother and girlfriend.
Now, if I take from him powers, friends and beauty, he would be... roughly the same. Yes, instead of pursuing supernatural criminals, he would have a more regular life. He would be a normal student, a popular guy (he is not shy, don't forget it) that half-hides his love for everything geek, like videogames, comics and RPGs. I mean, he wouldn't talk about his interests in public, but it would be no secret to his friends. Without an energetic vampiric brain, he wouldn't have as many abilities as he has now, but I'm sure he would still be a good musician, and probably would be good at one sport, at least. He is disciplined enough for that.
You see? He doesn't have any of the things that made him **special**, but is still a lively character. You could like him all the same, without the powers, his vampirism, his connections with powerful people and his beauty. Now, it doesn't mean that he is free from being a Mary Sue/Gary Stu. We just began to clear the path. The other thing you must check is:
2 - He/She actually DO special things with his/her special traits: So, your character passed the test above and you feel good. But danger still lurks around the corners.
You see, even if you don't actively believes in karma (or some variation of karma, as I do), all humans have a built-in voice that cries "INJUSTICE" every time we see someone having something without deserving it. So, if you gave your character lots of special traits, you better have a good reason for that.
Let's go back to Batman. Yes, he has skills enough to divide between ten human lifes. But you can forgive him for that. The enemies he faces often force him to use every bit of those abilities. And even with them, he has problems fighting and he escapes defeat very narrowly, sometimes. No one NEED to say in plain letters that Batman is intelligent, resourceful and skilled. He spends entire advertures proving that to you. He is a cool character doing cool things, and he pays a high price for that - his sanity, his private life, his personal safety. Seems fair to us.
Now, if a character is awesome, but everything goes right to him/her without much of an effort, you feel like all those traits are wasted, and that things are not fair. Case in point: Bella Swan. The Twilight books says that she is nice, but everytime she acts nice, it's a stupid decision. The book says that she is beautiful, but she has one of the lowest self-esteems of the literary world. When she becomes a vampire (come on, it's not a spoiler anymore), the book says that she is incredibly powerful, and she ends in a battle with many powerful vampires on her side. Well, in the end, a Deus Ex Machina drops from the sky and we have no battle. It's not even a good diplomatic effort, with clever use of tact and planning. It's just... the author's finger, saying that the book is long enough and she wants to finish it at once. All the way, our brain says UNFAIR! UNFAIR! Bella almost doesn't accomplish anything in a cool or intelligent way through the series. Why bother with giving her tons of good traits if she won't use? Or if it would cut the story in a half if she used? No, seriously, if Bella was intelligent enough, half of her problems wouldn't exist.
----
Phew. Quite a lot of things. But I guess I made my point clear. Having a Mary Sue/Gary Stu in hands actually depends on how developed the personality of you character is and how good it works in the plot. It doesn't depend on WHAT your character is, racially speaking, what job he/she has, how many people fall in love to him/her. Plenty of other things have to be wrong to make it a real Mary Sue case. With all that, I'm not saying "KILL ALL THE MARY SUES! RAAAAWR!" I'm saying "Develop your characters, my friends. Thay can be cool AND good, you just need to make them deeper."
Good luck!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The article ends here. Note that I'm talking about OCs. Fanfiction is another thing. One writes fanfic as one pleases, it's something that exists solely for fun purposes. Of course, your fanfiction will get better to larger audiences if you de-Mary Sue it, but if you thinks it's ok, so it's ok. Good luck and have fun! o/
What's wrong with Mary Sues?
Here, in Brazil, the term "Mary Sue" (and her male counterpart, the Gary Stu) is a reletively unknown one. And I discovered that trying to explain what a Mary Sue is can be something... complex. You know, many people try to use the classical way of conceptualization to describe a Mary Sue (i.e., people try to find things that all characters labelled Mary Sues have in common). That's a mistake. A terrible mistake.
You can pick a bunch of characters that are Mary Sues in the hands of an author, but very cool characters in the hands of others. The SAME characters. Being a scientist (I have a major in Chemistry), I decided to analyse a Mary Sue bit by bit until we can understand who is and who isn't a Mary Sue in literature.
Basically, a Mary Sue is a character that went wrong. But not in every way. Mary Sues go wrong in a very specific way. Let me create some categories of fictional characters, for didatical puporses (did you miss them?):
1 - Overpower (OP): these are the guys that, through special training or sheer luck, are extremely skilled at something. They are greatly strong and/or intelligent and/or observant, they are kung fu masters or music maestros. A OP character would be, for instance, Superman.
2 - Friends to all living things (I'm borrowing the name from TV Tropes, but I mean a different thing): they are those characters that are so nice/kind/helpful/adorable that they make friends with everyone, even if they are clumsy or not much skilled in their jobs. Sometimes, they make friends even among the enemies. Sailor Moon is a good example.
3 - Gorgeous: these characters draw attention upon themselves just by existing. They are incredibly beautiful/intelligent/rich/famous, leaving everyone dazzled. An unusual, but valid, example of this is Sherlock Holmes. He is so famous and smart that everyone around him respect and follow him without much effort (despite his eventual rudeness).
Now, people usually say that a Mary Sue is a character that have the three traits at once: she has enormous abilities, everyone is her friend and everyone falls in love with her at first sight because she is gorgeous. Other people make long checklists listing cliché traits and tell us that a Mary Sue is a character that has X cliché traits.
The thing is, a character with many clichés attached is just a cliché character, not a Mary Sue. A Disney-Princess-like character may be cliché, but she's not a Sue. AND plenty of good characters are in categories 1, 2 e 3 above. Let's take Batman. He is 1 - a master at martial arts, detection, forensic science, driving, engineering, computers, can fly a plane, has an incredible memory and a remarkable physical endurance 2 - a character that, despite being rude and impolite, sometimes, is acquainted with almost all DC Universe (good) characters, a way or another and 3 - everyone instantly love and respects him because he is BATMAN. Seriously, Batman has learned more abilities than he could in a human life. I suspect time travel.
Or let me pick Harry Potter, 1 - the chosen one, the boy who lived, the one that defeated Voldemort when he was a baby (I know, technically, it was his mother, but still), the youngest Catcher in Hogwarts, the boy who produced a Patron good enough to impress adults, the guy who defeated Voldemort once a book. 2 - a common, nice boy, that ended with all Hogwarts (except Slytherin) rooting for him, despite small quarrells here and there. 3 - always earned fame and even some good favors because of his scar and what it represents.
OK, those two are not totally in category 2 (most people in this category are girls, for some reason, but there are many guys here), but they are far from be lonely people, or guys with just a few friends and virtually no important relations, like us mortals.
The point is, it doesn't matter if you character is half-human, half-something, with great powers, great heart and an attractive face or reputation. This isn't enough to make him or her a Mary Sue.
Now, I know you are wondering: "But... But... You can't compare Batman with Lucretia Snape-Lupin Potter III. The first is a good character and the last isn't. WHAT'S WRONG, THEN?"
Two things, my friends. The line separating good characters from Mary Sues doesn't lie in superficial things or character traits. It lies in two things:
1 - Personality deepness: It doesn't matter how much (or how little) powers and positive traits you character has. If his/her personality is shallow, nothing will save him/her. The best test for Mary Sue isn't filling checklists for clichés. No, no, just give the character the Bane treatment: break his/her spine, strip him/her of all physical beauty and all supernatural powers that this character may have. Even supernatural empathy. Let's say that no one will look your character and "like him/her naturally, without being able to explain it". After all that, what's left of your character? If he/she suddenly lost powers, beauty and friends, what would he/she do? If you have no answer to that or if you say that your character would be ruined FOREVER, than, I'm sorry to say that I'm 99% sure that this character is a Mary Sue/Gary Stu of the worse kind.
I'll give you an example: Diego, one of my protagonists, always score high in MS tests. After all, he is a teenager vampire, a good musician and a skilled supernatural cop (in training). Among his abilities, he is good in hand-to-hand combat, has supernatural force, speed and regeneration, enhanced senses and is able to use a lot of gadgets. He is a talkative guy with a good sense of humour and a little touch of smugness - not enough to make him unbearable, just the right measure to make people laugh. He makes friends easily, since he is everything but shy, and he is handsome, which make him a chic magnet. Beneath all this mask of self-assurance, he is a good guy, with geek tendencies and a great need for approval, specially from his mother and girlfriend.
Now, if I take from him powers, friends and beauty, he would be... roughly the same. Yes, instead of pursuing supernatural criminals, he would have a more regular life. He would be a normal student, a popular guy (he is not shy, don't forget it) that half-hides his love for everything geek, like videogames, comics and RPGs. I mean, he wouldn't talk about his interests in public, but it would be no secret to his friends. Without an energetic vampiric brain, he wouldn't have as many abilities as he has now, but I'm sure he would still be a good musician, and probably would be good at one sport, at least. He is disciplined enough for that.
You see? He doesn't have any of the things that made him **special**, but is still a lively character. You could like him all the same, without the powers, his vampirism, his connections with powerful people and his beauty. Now, it doesn't mean that he is free from being a Mary Sue/Gary Stu. We just began to clear the path. The other thing you must check is:
2 - He/She actually DO special things with his/her special traits: So, your character passed the test above and you feel good. But danger still lurks around the corners.
You see, even if you don't actively believes in karma (or some variation of karma, as I do), all humans have a built-in voice that cries "INJUSTICE" every time we see someone having something without deserving it. So, if you gave your character lots of special traits, you better have a good reason for that.
Let's go back to Batman. Yes, he has skills enough to divide between ten human lifes. But you can forgive him for that. The enemies he faces often force him to use every bit of those abilities. And even with them, he has problems fighting and he escapes defeat very narrowly, sometimes. No one NEED to say in plain letters that Batman is intelligent, resourceful and skilled. He spends entire advertures proving that to you. He is a cool character doing cool things, and he pays a high price for that - his sanity, his private life, his personal safety. Seems fair to us.
Now, if a character is awesome, but everything goes right to him/her without much of an effort, you feel like all those traits are wasted, and that things are not fair. Case in point: Bella Swan. The Twilight books says that she is nice, but everytime she acts nice, it's a stupid decision. The book says that she is beautiful, but she has one of the lowest self-esteems of the literary world. When she becomes a vampire (come on, it's not a spoiler anymore), the book says that she is incredibly powerful, and she ends in a battle with many powerful vampires on her side. Well, in the end, a Deus Ex Machina drops from the sky and we have no battle. It's not even a good diplomatic effort, with clever use of tact and planning. It's just... the author's finger, saying that the book is long enough and she wants to finish it at once. All the way, our brain says UNFAIR! UNFAIR! Bella almost doesn't accomplish anything in a cool or intelligent way through the series. Why bother with giving her tons of good traits if she won't use? Or if it would cut the story in a half if she used? No, seriously, if Bella was intelligent enough, half of her problems wouldn't exist.
----
Phew. Quite a lot of things. But I guess I made my point clear. Having a Mary Sue/Gary Stu in hands actually depends on how developed the personality of you character is and how good it works in the plot. It doesn't depend on WHAT your character is, racially speaking, what job he/she has, how many people fall in love to him/her. Plenty of other things have to be wrong to make it a real Mary Sue case. With all that, I'm not saying "KILL ALL THE MARY SUES! RAAAAWR!" I'm saying "Develop your characters, my friends. Thay can be cool AND good, you just need to make them deeper."
Good luck!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The article ends here. Note that I'm talking about OCs. Fanfiction is another thing. One writes fanfic as one pleases, it's something that exists solely for fun purposes. Of course, your fanfiction will get better to larger audiences if you de-Mary Sue it, but if you thinks it's ok, so it's ok. Good luck and have fun! o/
Comments8
Join the community to add your comment. Already a deviant? Log In
StrixVanAllenHobbyist General Artist
Glad you liked it. XD
PuddingValkyrieHobbyist Digital Artist
I nearly died rereading this and getting to "You can't compare Batman with Lucretia Snape-Lupin Potter III." XD
StrixVanAllenHobbyist General Artist
Admittely, Albus Potter's name opens a precedent for Lucretia's name. xD
DdraigtantoProfessional Writer
Sounds like a good way of approaching Mary or Gary Sues. I will have to use this again in the future when I write my OCs more.
StrixVanAllenHobbyist General Artist
I'm glad it's useful. ^^
Join the community to add your comment. Already a deviant? Log In