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Sonic dissected 11-1

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By Rogerregorroger   |   
Published:
© 2013 - 2020 Rogerregorroger
Footage used from Sega- capcom-accolade-Monolith-Konami-Apogee.

Part 1: [link]

Part 2: [link]

Part 3: [link]

Part 4: [link]

Part 5: [link]

Part 6: [link]

Part 7: [link]

Part 8: [link]

Part 9: [link]

Part 10: [link]

Part 11-1: [link]

Part 11-2: [link]

part 11-3: [link]

Part 11-4-1: [link]

Part 11-4-2: [link]

Part 11-5-1: [link]

Part 11-5-2: [link]

Part 12: [link]

Lost world special:[link]

Part 13-1: [link]

Part 13-2: [link]

Big one. Talking about the level design of all Sonic platform games. Jup.
Going to split it up in some parts tough, footage makes the files heavy.

Footage used from Sega- capcom-accolade-Monolith-Konami-Apogee.
Thanks to Alex as level design consulant.
Image size
550x450px 28.6 MB
Comments80
anonymous's avatar
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Gregory66613's avatar
Gregory66613Hobbyist Writer
being stuck with Sonic CD for Android for a week has really opened my eyes as it were. the levels are designed to slow you down only if you don't know the layouts. It like Unleashed where it slows you down with the slightest mistake but CD is more effective, and better designed because it doesn't kill you for failure, suck out all your lives, give you a crappy rank and then murder your family while tampering with your school grades. It's interesting to see people memorize all these Sonic level layouts to know the obstacles and get great times... and then see those same people calling Sonic CD out for shit level design. Of course I'm playing the rerelease which fixed some bugs like framerate and collision detection, and time attack mode removes all time-posts so i dunno. Maybe it's just me but it's right up there with Sonic 3 and Knuckles.
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
Interesting tought.

I have to be honest, I didn't play Sonic CD very thoroughly during my research, and when I played it as a kid I just plowed troguh it, so I never noticed anything like that.
Might take a new look. At the moment, all I remember is often getting stuck between 2 bumpers knocking me all over the place.
Gregory66613's avatar
Gregory66613Hobbyist Writer

yeah, it was either that or Angry Birds for a whole week. and I played the android version which ran at a constant 60 frames per second. and considering touch screen controls, the later quarter of the game got very maddening and I never even bothered with the special stages.

It doesn't deserve the hate it gets for being too platform focused and slow, but it certainly isn't the best game in the series.

GrandMetroViper's avatar
GrandMetroViperHobbyist General Artist
NOT TEH BESTEST GAME EVAR IT'S FOR ME

Just Kidding I really do love the game to call it my favorite of the series but I do have the same problems you do. It's equally infuriating considering the core function is traveling through time and the way to do so is to keep moving at a steady pace without stopping. I remember vanilla CD had collision detection problems which fucked me over and I recently began playing the re-released version on PSN which is......slightly better but not perfect. It's still playable but the criticisms aren't wrong.
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
Hate?
I tought it was one of people's favorites.
Sigh, people's opinions about each game changes everytime.
Altough, it's probably becaue there's at least 3 diffrent Sonic fan factions.
Whatever.
9898989889898989's avatar
9898989889898989Hobbyist General Artist
Does Knuckle Chaotix fit in any of these phases?  It felt more Sonic-ish than any of the other game's I asked about.
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
hard to say, haven't played the game much but the level design seemed inconsistent to me, like each world has it's own rules.
Kinda reminds me of Sonic CD, it has less a rhytm or logic and is more ideas and gimmick based levels.

So I suppose they would count as the Sonic adventure 1 kind of level design, only 2d.
9898989889898989's avatar
9898989889898989Hobbyist General Artist
Would Sonic Robo Blast or Sonic Robo Blast 2 fit in to any of these phases?
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
This chapter focuses on platform games designed to make SOnic as fast as possible, all the titles you mention are spin offs that have a completely diffrent direction and don't really belong in any category.

Both Chronicles and Robo blast don't fit in any category here, both being wide open and not having many complex platform elements. More Mario 64 with a super fast Mario then any of the categories here.
9898989889898989's avatar
9898989889898989Hobbyist General Artist
How about Sonic Chronicles?
9898989889898989's avatar
9898989889898989Hobbyist General Artist
What phase of level design is Sonic Schoolhouse?
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
Hahaha, Wolfenstein 3d or something, nothing remotely mentioned in these video's.
Waimbert's avatar
Fantastic video as always Roger, you, Luke, and Alex really hit the nail on the head concerning Sonic level design. But Boy oh Boy you got to love the classic era and adventure era of Sonic game level design. They were so much fun and rewarding then game that followed afterward. Though, the problem with speedy platforming is that its over far too quickly. Where as Mario and Zelda titles the player is alway encourage explore the world, while Sonic game focus on speed and thrills. Which I love by the way. XD
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
If they could create cool adventure fields like in Sonic adventure, that are fun to explore, then you could get that back.
I'd like the idea of a Mario 64 esque Sonic game.
darkmx4's avatar
Whoever that woman is she sounds EXTREMELY high.
babyxdinosaur's avatar
Alexandra is a quebecer :D she has the accent
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
Heh, very easy to pick out a Quebecer, eh?
I recognise them very quickly too, even when they just type, heh.
babyxdinosaur's avatar
yeah, we have a wierd accent xD It makes me laugh everytime I hear it ^^' huhuhu
AdoubleA's avatar
I have an accent even in French

Saguenay lala
Arexion's avatar
Rayman Origins has to be one of those few games that got the sense of speed right. Yes it has slow levels, but those chase levels have to be one of those rare levels where you just keep on runnig without stopping. Since the camera is zoomed back enough and they do not introduce any unknown game mechanics in these levels, they do not feel all that cheap and when you fail, you more of blame yourself. Of course there are some parts that are based on pure memorisation but even then. Rayman Origins is basically what Sonic wanted to be.
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
Only played a 3 level demo of Rayman origins, so can't judge that statement.
I consider Rayman 2 to be one of the best 3d platformers of all time, while Rayman 3 is one of the most boring 3d platformers of all time, so he's hit and miss.

But what I remember from Rayman 1, and the 3 levels of Origins I played, while Rayman is extremely tough to play, I do feel it's mostly my own fault when I died, so the game does feel fair. And it did have a good pacing. And it does use the speed as part of the challenge, rather then have the speed only complicate the challenge. So who knows what kind of cool Sonic game Ubisoft could cook up.
Dracold's avatar
DracoldHobbyist General Artist
Indeed, that is what I am always saying. I don't understand the people who claim that Sonic is about speed and yet the old 2D platforming games were the only good games. That is an oxymoron for me.
Maybe I didn't catch that correctly, but you may have missed one more argument why platformer games are not meant to be only focused on the speed itself. It is not just that there are many examples of games that do not do that (including some of the Sonic games), but it is technically impossible.
How can you be propelled very fast forward in 2D game and still "playing" the game? You see Sonic in the middle of a screen... A screen with a very small resolution. Player can see in all directions only very limited distance. That is like 6 to 8 times Sonic's height? How come that hero who can supposedly run faster then a speed of sound will be able to react to anything? Such a small distance you can see will be at this speed (or even a lower speed which is present in some games) overcome in fractions of second. So you are telling the player: go wild, run as faster you can. But if you overcome 10 screen lengths in a second, how can you possibly play that game? Either is the level designed to play itself, or it is making you react in superhuman speed. And not just that, you can't possibly react if you are falling into a hole or a trap. You must believe that either direction you choose, you will never be punished for that (unless you remember the whole level, then you can choose right).
And since I am the person who enjoys the speed gameplay, I must say that I could never ever play the old 2D Sonic games and have the same feeling or the same experience. It's in fact a completely different gameplay. In 3D, you can see miles in front of you if you have an open space. In 2D you can't. It almost sounds to me, that those who only want to play the 2D platforming style of his games are in fact denying who he is - or who he was made to be after it was decided that he is the fastest thing alive.
Rogerregorroger's avatar
RogerregorrogerHobbyist Filmographer
Because the better 2d games force you to slow down before danger comes.
The only games you're really describing with this complaint are teh rush games. Or specifically the first, Rush adventure had slightly more damage control.
anonymous's avatar
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