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Elaphrosaurus

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By Qilong   |   
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Such a strange animal. Last described in the 1920s, it hasn't been dealt with seriously since, although the original description is quite thourough and detailed (albeit in German). This animal has been linked to the abelisaurs, and now appears to be unique simply because it has the longest legs for its mass than any other abelisaur known.
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anonymous's avatar
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Skull-Island-Master's avatar
Sorry i dont get it, so elaphrosaurus and limusaurus are now considered as noasaurids or abelisaurids ?? Then whats with deltadromeus ??
Qilong's avatar
Elaphrosaurus and Limusaurus are each apparently some of the most basal members of a group called Abelisauria. This includes "Elaphrosauridae" (incl. perhaps Spinostropheus), Noasauridae, and Abelisauridae. Sereno et al. originally indicated through a limited analysis that Deltadromeus might be a coelurosaur, but most of these features were recently found to also appear in various abelisaurs ("abelisaur" refers to Abelisauria, and abelisaurian, not abelisaurids = Abelisauridae). The huge shoulders, thin feet, and various other vertebral features now seem to point to a large-bodied, late-surviving basal abelisaurian, for Deltadromeus. This being based on two analyses which use mostly the same dataset to produce their results. That's all I know.
Skull-Island-Master's avatar
i thought that deltadrmezus was a basal noasaur as ther are some skeletal features in the foot that only appear in noasaurids.
Qilong's avatar
So far, the research is ambiguous. The latest suggests that it is a really honkin' big noasaur-like animal. This may very well be true.
Skull-Island-Master's avatar
would be awsome to see how you do a deltadromeus, may yiou make one at some point of time ??
Qilong's avatar
Oh, I won't ever be able to do this without being able to see the material better, and it would not look much different than, say, [link]
Skull-Island-Master's avatar
but didnt carrano and sampson say it was outiside the noasaurs, though i still hope it was a noasaurid.
Qilong's avatar
At the moment, I think there's a lot about Delta we don't know about, the material is actually pretty scarce for the most part (we are missing large areas, such as most of the limbs and vertebrae) that obscures its affinities, hence the large number of differing opinions that evolve as new data gets added.
bryan1231's avatar
i always thought that the Elaphrosaurus was related to the Ceratosaurids, like ceratosaurus and limusaurus.
Qilong's avatar
This is still generally true, at least historically when you consider that Ceratosauria as it is still conceived may contain Abelisauria. Recent arguments prefer placing Abelisauria outside of a classic Ceratosauria, which would contain perhaps only Ceratosaurus, Coelophysidae, and a few other taxa, and may not contain Limusaurus, which would be closer to Abelisauria.
bryan1231's avatar
so, basically, if the abelisaurids are aoutside of Caratosauria, then Ceratosarus, the Coelophysids and a couple other species would be the only ceratosaurids?
Qilong's avatar
There is a small set of well-done analyses that indicate that Abelisauria, then Ceratosauridae, then Ceolophysoidea are serial outgroups of Tetanurae. Some analyses place Coelophysoidea in Ceratosauria, while others place all of them in Ceratosauria. There isn't a whole lot of consensus on this.
bryan1231's avatar
I see. Protoceratosaurus (a previous member of the ceratosauria) is now a tyrannpsaurid, so that got me thinking: are the ceratosaurids close relatives of tyrannosaurids?
Qilong's avatar
Definately not. Tyrannosauroids are coelurosaurs, unlike ceratosaurs or abelisaurs. There are enough differences there that they are firmly not related to one another.
bryan1231's avatar
i see. big bad t-rex is more closely related to Compsognathus than Ceratosaurus. Are Maniraptors thier own group, or coleurosaurs too?
Qilong's avatar
Coelurosauria includes Maniraptora as well as Tyrannosauroidea.

[link]

There is a link to Dr. Tom Holtz' lecture page on the subject of Theropoda arrangements. Check it out and follow the links.
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EmperorDinobot's avatar
The famous "first ornithomimosaur"...meeh.
Haxeman's avatar
Noasaurids are the basalmost Abelisaouroids, and if Elaphrosaurus turns out to be a basal Abelisauroid, maybe it could have looked like a Noasaurid. Really nice, congratulations!
Qilong's avatar
Thanks. Some studies muck around with where Elaphrosaurus sits relative to noasaurids and abelisaurids. It is currently undergoing new study, so hopefully clarifying phylogenetic works can be made.
SteeleLord's avatar
very insteresting
SmallNaughtyOrc's avatar
SmallNaughtyOrc Digital Artist
I love also it :nod:
:+fav:
Afrovenator's avatar
Looks incredible! What are your reasons for giving it the skull shape that you gave it actually?
Qilong's avatar
That came after I started looking at the possible skull of Noasaurus, with the jaw of Masiakasaurus. These are close in morphic space, technically, so I figured a basal, nontetanuran jaw, with down-sloping snout. That's pretty much it. It was probably a little larger, just how Masiakasaurus' head is much bigger. I should post my Noasaurus sometime, to really draw attention to these little guys' weirdness.
anonymous's avatar
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