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Anti logic

By ErinPtah
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For the record, this kind of thing is how you can tell that "anti shipping" is really "shipwars and general sex-negativity, dressed up in progressive buzzwords."

Tumblr: Reblog from here, don't repost.

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Tumblr: People are shipping BAD THINGS and need to STOP!
Artist: Oh, hello, Tumblr Voltron fandom. Mad about your shippers again?

Tumblr: Haven't you seen them?! They like fiction where adults have sex with teenagers. Teenagers! That means they're pedophile apologists, and enabling child abuse, and making fandom unsafe!

Artist: Okay, look. Setting aside the part where you're contorting the meaning of "pedophilia" to include attraction to people who aren't even under 18: Your argument is that . . . when fans enjoy fiction about adults doing something to teenagers that would be immoral in real life . . . those fans are endorsing real-life child abuse?

Tumblr: Yes!! If they're adult fans, they're basically abusers themselves!
Artist: What about fans who enjoy fiction about adults recruiting teenagers as child soldiers and deploying them into a war zone?

Tumblr: . . .

Artist: I mean, by your own logic, just being a fan of the Voltron canon means you're endorsing the real abuse of --
Tumblr: It doesn't count when we're talking about things I like!!
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anonymous's avatar
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RobinTheBard's avatar
Frankly I don't like the shows where they turn children into soldiers and send them into dangerous war zones either but I digress
ErinPtah's avatar
Nothing wrong with having your own likes and dislikes. As long as you don't harass random fans of the shows you don't like, you're good.
General-RADIX's avatar
Not to be that guy, but: if you really are concerned that someone's attitude towards certain ships is inappropriate or outright toxic, does that still make you a ship-negative/fake-progressive jerk? I ask this as someone who's seen a lot of genuinely grody stuff.
ErinPtah's avatar
I do think there are ways to be concerned that aren't dishonest or spurious. It depends a lot on context. Are you disturbed by the shippers' attitudes toward some real thing, or just by the fiction they like?

The creepiest pairing on this list is probably Jessica/Kilgrave. He's unambiguously the rapist who gave her PTSD. And if there were shippers who thought it was a sweet fluffy romance, or who thought real rape survivors should love their abusers, that would be a legitimate reason to be creeped out. Even to chastise those fans.

But I've never seen that kind of shipper. I've only seen people who want to read and write stories that engage with the abuse (which also describes anyone who likes the Jessica Jones series itself). Sometimes they want to explore darkfic scenarios, like Stockholm syndrome, specifically *because* they would never want those things to happen in real life. Fiction lets it happen without any real people getting hurt.

In Voltron, if there are fans who ship Shiro/Pidge because they believe real 23-year-old men dating 15-year-old girls is great, those people are creeps. But most shippers are taking it as part of the fictional universe where 15-year-olds are capable of being combat pilots. It's just another example of suspension of disbelief in order to enjoy a story.

...and even if there are shippers who kink on the age difference and like fic where it's realistically creepy, the important thing is still "do they inflict this kink on real teenagers, or do they restrict it to fiction, and maybe ageplay with real consenting adults?" It only gets toxic if they can't maintain healthy boundaries between fiction and reality.
General-RADIX's avatar
Admittedly, I haven't seen too many shippers with those attitudes myself, but to my understanding, people like that are still out there? Maybe they're just a lot rarer nowadays (back in '05 to '08 or so, when I lurked on fanficrants, IIRC there were a LOT of posts about authors whose attitudes were like the negative ones you described) and/or aren't visible for long.
ErinPtah's avatar
Listen, I'm not saying the creeps don't exist (although I think you're right, they're getting rarer -- probably because of overall cultural shifts). Just that you can't identify a creep based solely on "they write/draw/read/like X/Y." And that kind of accusation is the rallying cry of the people who identify as "anti shippers" -- which have unfortunately been getting more *common* in recent years.
chloviejeo's avatar
tumblr can be stupid 
anonymous's avatar
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