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What I can't do...

Journal Entry: Sun Oct 25, 2009, 1:29 AM

Well, this will be short and to the point.

I tried.

I have always had a sort of inner desire to do a series of intense, erotic fantasy illustrations. So, I started doing simple pieces, to warm up. Then I thought about the fact that doing a set of pieces and uploading them here would bring more attention to my gallery, and through that, to my posts in the Art Scene forum, which is what means the most to me here.

But, if that's the main reason I do them, I just can't.

I can't sell out like that. Every time I've tried, in the last few months, to start a piece, that thought would come into my mind, and the desire to daw would just fade.

So, I'll probably do some pieces in that vein. But I have to do them on the down low. On my own, without any thought of posting them here. It's not that I don't want you guys tosee them, it's just that I can't do them if the reason is to garner more hits on my page here. After becoming a contributing member here, and after developing a measure of community respect by virtue of my psts in the forums, doing that would seem like the worst kind of sell-out to me.

Am I right to see it that way?

You tell me.

  • Listening to: Working on my originals on guitar
  • Reading: everything I can find by R.A. Salvatore
  • Watching: True Blood and diggin the crap out of it
  • Playing: every chance I get
  • Eating: at least once a day
  • Drinking: now and then. But only in moderation
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wwwEAMONREILLYdotCOM Featured By Owner Nov 4, 2009  Professional Traditional Artist
Do it as an alter ego. Like Bono made up characters, in his shows like mcphisto and the fly, to say the things he couldn't say as Bono. Put on a certain hat, become another character and do your art as him/it. Open up another DA page as him/it. Worth a try??
Darkmir Featured By Owner Nov 4, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
Not sure, but a hell of a interesting idea. I'll think seriously about it.
wwwEAMONREILLYdotCOM Featured By Owner Nov 8, 2009  Professional Traditional Artist
Do. :D. Then a lot of great authours have written books under different names and in a different style. Re-invention is the way to go.:D Frees us of our labels, stereotypes, etc.
Darkmir Featured By Owner Nov 8, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
Narkya Featured By Owner Oct 26, 2009  Hobbyist Photographer
I never do something so I can upload it. That's just not WHY I'm doing art. I'm doing it because I like it and I show them if I think they work out or if I need some critics.
This thing of drawing for attention seems somewhat out of the way for me and if it's the same for you, just don't do it.
Dojang Featured By Owner Oct 26, 2009
i think you're looking at it the wrong way.

heck, half the people who respond to your posts in the art scene probably don't even visit your page...((laughs) that's not a great way to see it either!)

more seriously. don't think of making art or interesting, thought provoking posts FOR da. these things should occur naturally in the person called darkmir. this place is just a lens through which everyone else can observe these aspects of that person.

so make the things. post them if you think they will also please others. you don't need motive...
Darkmir Featured By Owner Oct 26, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
I had already decided to respond to all the comments on this journal entry with a blanket new journal entry. But I thought I'd handle this one perosnally.

It's not that I can't make the separation. In order to have people really understand this fully would have required another amazingly long post, and I just didn't feel that this issue warranted that. What it really boils down to is me questioning my motivations in light of a growing lethargy when it comes to creating new art at all. At least for the time being, anyway.

Somethinng tells me that at some point in what is left of my life (damn that sounds bad... I may live another 30 or 40 years, afterall), the motivation will return to me to do art to do work based on a personal inspiration... to express the culmination of a lifetime of working and drawing creatively, and what it has caused to develop in me as an individual human being. I really want to wait until that happens before I go to great lengths to produce a body of new work. But, I also want to feel that I am supporting my participation at DA with more than just what I accomplished in my past, however recent that may be.

Over the next year, I'll be producing a number of new commercial works for a few clients I have held onto as I've gone through my health problems and surgeries. I'll make money on this work (making it gneerally relevent as examples of the output of a woking professional), but much of it will likely be work I am not all that proud of on a personal level. How many catalog layouts, for example, do I really need to show here?

So the question is clearly one I'll ultimately have to deal with on my own. I guess I just floated the journal post because I don't know the answers to these questions for myself yet, and I want to. I think maybe I was hoping someone might have some insight from their own experiences that would give me a way to look at all of this.

But I know that it will eventually come down to me deciding when to work, and why to work, on new original creative pieces, on my own, in the end.
Dojang Featured By Owner Oct 27, 2009
to be honest, i do kinda think of you as the wise old master of art direction...that stubble at the base of your icon probably extends into a sensei beard another 100 pixels long...


sounds like you've got it mostly tied down, in spite of claiming to be confused.

a lot of this angst you're expressing seems to be something to do with your body of work living up to the grand silhuette your forum posts cast, rather than just sharing work on it's own merit...

i'm not sure if i'm helping or not...

on lethargy and creative inertia- i hear you. heck, i'm only 20 and most days feel pretty creatively bland to me...don't get me wrong, i'm a 'draw on command' kinda guy, but creation of entirely new concepts and images isn't something i've been pursuing lately...

like i said, though, sounds like you've got it killed.

also, what the hell? why would people hang around here for things you "accomplished in my past"? i for one am hanging around to see new works, whatever form that might take, creative, professional, or your thought-provoking journals and forum posts.

it's not like people are devwatching you just so that they have an easy link to your old work.

just, don't stress about us. stress about this ongoing creative lethargy of yours, sure, but the people here are already your audience, you don't need to attract them again.
Darkmir Featured By Owner Oct 27, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
Not helping but not hurting. I absolutely will never get the big head over my posts. That would negate every reason I started posting in the first place.

And yeah, I probably do know how I'm gonna handle it. I just wanted to har the thoughts of others artists on the subject, mostly. One of the great returns for participating here is being able to actually talk with other like minded people.

Kinda like group therapy...:)
Dojang Featured By Owner Oct 28, 2009
awesome. good luck.
stampingqueen Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
Just something for you to think about... How about a secondary account for that art? Many people separate their art forms and what not here for many reasons. If you want to do those pieces and you want others to see them, then why not post them on a second account that is just for art in that vein? It would keep your forum posts and what not separate and still allow everyone who wishes to see your art to do so. I hate for anyone to silence an artistic urge just because they don't want to be perceived as trying to get pageviews etc. That you are so concerned about it shows that it is not your main intent. I say go for it and see what happens. Worst thing would be people would like them, enjoy your art, want to know more about you and then end up here that way. If they are not seriously interested in your other art they won't end up here and they have not raised your pageviews or favorites here at all. Just my two cents worth though. :)
Tavenlee Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009
I can understand where you're coming from. I think that what people have been saying about if the point is not to garner more page views via these things, then you shouldn't feel bad to post them is true, but also, your feeling is valid. The art you put up, and how you present yourself correctly or incorrectly changes people's perceptions of you.

I'm not saying it's right for people to look at drawings like that, and then consider you a "sell out" or that your posts or advice is less valid, but I think that there would be some of that. I don't think the extra page views that would come as a side effect of posting such things would necessarily help you either. Again, not to say that everyone who enjoys that type of art is less serious or mature, but there is a trend that way.

I think it's really about how you want to present yourself to the world, and how much you care about what people think, good or bad. There isn't a right answer here, but whatever makes you feel comfortable is best. If every time you think about posting that sort of thing here it makes you feel unmotivated and uncomfortable, despite that you want to draw those things, then draw them anyways, and just don't put them up. It's completely how you feel about it.

Hendrick Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009   General Artist
One of the secondary reasons we create art is for people to see it. (Primary reason is our need to create) So don't worry about the page views. Create because you want to create. Because you are a contributing member here, no one with any brains will accuse you of selling out and those that do, well... piss on them, they don't know squat. Ultimately create the art you want to create and show it where you want to show it.
PixlPhantasy Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
A subject everyone will see differently so here's my 2 cents. dA is a community based site. We post art because its what we like to do, no matter the subject. We have forums to openly discuss various degrees of the art world. Granted there are people who use the forums more than the galleries and vice vercy but you'll find that anywhere.

Your forum posts are already quite popular. I don't see how posting your work is going to make people look at it any different. So what if you pick up a few more voices through your art to add to the fray? I found you from the forums in the first place, some people would find you then your forums. Just how it works with this type of community.

If you like your work and enjoy it, it shouldn't hinder any other participation in the community, forums included. :D Yea sure you may get some more page views and a few of them may even go on to find you in the forums but with the number of people on this site vs the numbers in forums is quite different. Quite a number of people don't use the forums at all or even know they exist. (took me a few months to find them :XD:)

Most of my watchers I never even see on the forums so the logic of using your art to gain more popularity in the forums..just doesnt seem logical. Now being a thumbshare whore is an entirely different story. :giggle: I never see you in that forum so enough said.

Okay enough ranting, point being your gallery and your forum posts are two seperate entities. There's a few bridges between the two but they work both ways. If you like your art and want to share it then post it. If you like getting the community thinking then by all means keep posting in the forums. People will find you regardless.

RogerRaven Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009  Hobbyist General Artist
I sometimes go through this same thing too, questioning if I should submit certain drawings to DA or not, if this is a cheap attempt to just get more pageveiws and watchers or not.
So I think to myself:

1) Am I doing this for others or for me?
2) What kind of public am I going to attract with this?
3) Do I want to be associated with this kind of work?

In the end, I came to the conclusion that I will post my drawings, but in another art site, were I think it's more appropriate and I am able to separate my "normal" art from my "mature" art.

Remember, sex sells, there's no way around it, if your feeling to draw is genuine and you don't mind if you're later associated around DA mainly for your erotic works, then post them, I'm sure there's a lot of people who appreciate erotic fantasy for it's artistic quality, but if you do mind, I'd suggest you look for a site were you feel more comfortable in posting them.
Blades-123 Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009  Hobbyist Digital Artist
My two cents? Just go for it! Don't torture yourself worrying about your own motivation. Every writer and artist in history has created their stuff for a mixture of different reasons, and you can be damn sure that a healthy part of their motivation was to win acclaim, to feel appreciated, or, quite simply, to earn a living. Shakespeare laced his tragedies with earthy comic scenes because he knew it would please the punters in the cheap seats at the Globe. Holbien did flattering portraits of Henry the Eighth to pay his way and to draw attention to his work. This doesn't make them "sell-outs", it makes them human beings and artists.

So long as you enjoy doing the work, then have at it! I for one would love to see it. :)


beatn1k Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009  Professional General Artist
If your sole intent was to raise page views, it's a sell out imho. I would go so far as to say why ask us as obviously this is bothering you to the point where you haven't been drawing, and are actually going so far as feeling guilty for the which case your looking for permission from us to go ahead anyway, despite your feelings. I would say either don't do 'em, put em on the back burner, or do them, but only send them or allow certain people to view them. That would more than likely solve this. It would be like me asking you if I should be putting up manga & anime on my profile to boost views, in which case you already know that I would just be lying to myself in the end, and not really gaining anything out of that, outside of recognition for the wrong reason (and pageviews of course).

With all that aside, i also agree with cat, if your doing this work to actually DO it, and enjoy it, and your comfortable with at least that much, then maybe it isn't so bad after all. :ahoy:
Catwalksymphony Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2009
I think the problem is that you're going into it with that thought in your mind. Posting them here will grant you more views, yes. But all in all, the joy that we, as your friends and fans, get from seeing them, and the knowledge that people whose opinions you care about appreciate your work... is what matters.

I don't think it is a sell-out move, simply drawing something you enjoy and posting them here, knowing they will garner attention. It's something you want to do, don't let the after affects deter you from it. I would LOVE to see these if you draw them.

Basically I don't think that's your main motivation. You love art too much for it to be, I think you're AFRAID it WILL be your main motivation if it so happens to garner that after effect. It's not, so don't worry about it. Enjoy your work, and share it with those who also enjoy it. <3
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Submitted on
October 25, 2009