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Statist and Anarchist #236: Tax Cuts by BlameThe1st Statist and Anarchist #236: Tax Cuts by BlameThe1st

Even if we assume that Keynesian economics is accurate and correct (it's not!), and that the economy is driven by demand rather than supply (it's not!), how does any of that negate or disprove tax cuts?

If giving people more money allows them to better stimulate the economy, then why not give them more more by letting them keep the money they would have spent in taxes? The poor and middle class will have more money to spend on goods and services, while the rich would have more money to invest in said goods and services.

And before any of you dimbulbs insist that "tax cuts won't work", CoolidgeJFK, and Reagan would all disagree with you. Please educate yourselves.

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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Jan 7, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
So you're just going to sit there and let me shoot your entire argument out from under you?  If you don't even care enough about your arguments to defend them, why do you even bother making these pages?
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I would also point out that if you define "working" purely in terms of economic growth, the historical case is not so clear.  If you consider the eighties, nineties and naughts, taxes were highest during the nineties, but that was also when we saw the strongest growth.  The naughts had the lowest taxes and pretty mediocre growth.  And the biggest economic boom of them all - the post war expansion of the 1950's and 60's - occurred when taxes were much higher than they are now, especially on the rich.
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
The problem with "I don't wanna pay taxes" libertarianism is that government, and society in general, is like everything else in life: you get what you pay for.  You pay the cut rate piece of crap price you get the cute rate piece of crap product.  After three decades of, "You shouldn't have to pay taxes - the universe owes you a great country without having to pay for it," are you really surprised that our roads and bridges are falling apart, out infrastructure is crumbling, our education is substandard, and our institutions are fraying?  You lot like to complain about how inefficient government is.  Do you suppose that might possibly have something to do with paying civil servants slave wages?  Nahhhhhh, couldn't be!  It's pure coincidence!
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:iconmike-the-cat:
Mike-the-cat Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Except the government is a monopoly, so therefore they do not feel the need to improve their services no matter how much money they receive.
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Well, I don't entirely disagree with that statement, but I do think it can be a bit on the simplistic side.  Or at the very least I think it's often overly broadly used.

I'm not someone who thinks that government is the solution to all problems.  Government certainly has its problems.  But so do markets.  I tend to agree that all things being equal market solutions are generally preferable.  But there are some things that markets just don't do well.  the way I look at it is that both government and markets are tools that can be used to address issues in society.  Each has their strengths and weaknesses.

One thing I would like to point out is that market competition doesn't create efficiency and customer service on its own.  It provides the motive for companies to create the institutions that create efficiency and service.  Things like performance reviews, customer feedback, and so on.  Government can use those things as well.  What you need to make government work well (well, at least one of the things) is a culture of professionalism and public service, of pride in serving the country.  In my opinion, the way the right has been bashing government and civil servants for decades has seriously undermined that culture.
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:iconboshthehedgehog:
boshthehedgehog Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018
Democrats are the type of people who would be against the perfect tax reform that would benefit everybody guaranteed simply because the rich would benefit too.
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
So you feel entitled to a peaceful prosperous society without having to pay for it?
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:iconkajm:
Kajm Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018  Hobbyist Writer
closed minds like kkkessy don't seem to grasp that rich people USE money to generate business which earns them more money. And that business creates jobs, which then brings more taxes into the coffer. A booming economy in the long term would help reduce the budget deficit (IF and only IF those in government reign in spending to boot)
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:iconboshthehedgehog:
boshthehedgehog Featured By Owner Jan 19, 2018
Those minds also don't get the irony of accusing others of being entitled to a peaceful prosperous society without having to pay for it.  They constantly clamor for the government to provide them with an increasing number of goods and services because they're "fundamental human rights," when they're really just things leftists don't want to pay for.  It's just another example of them taking their issues and projecting them onto others that they don't like.
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2018  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Rich people using money = buying stocks, bonds, etc... ie, lending money to others.  If there's so much demand for borrowed money, why are interest rates so low?  You know, supply, demand, all that good stuff?
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Dec 31, 2017  Hobbyist Digital Artist
In fact, without some sort of rationale foundation, doesn't this page simply boil down to, "I don't want to pay taxes and I don't give a damn about the consequences"?
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:iconagnosticdragon:
AgnosticDragon Featured By Owner Dec 31, 2017  Hobbyist Writer
These numbers worry me: www.usdebtclock.org/
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Dec 31, 2017  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Not to mention the fact that Anarchist is conflating spending with investment - they are two distinctly different things.  And considering how low the price of capital is (interest rates), clearly there's no shortage of it.  How then will dumping yet more on the market help the economy?
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:iconkajm:
Kajm Featured By Owner Dec 30, 2017  Hobbyist Writer
Something tells me you got kkkessy's goat.
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Dec 29, 2017  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Of course, Anarchist is presenting a strawman here (quite deliberately, I suspect.)  The primary question isn't, "Will tax cuts stimulate the economy?"  It's, "Why in the world are you running up massive deficits on stimulus when we're already at full employment?"  you stimulate the economy when we're in a recession, not when we're already growing.  Running up massive deficits during an economic expansion is the epitome of recklessness.
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Dec 28, 2017  Hobbyist Digital Artist
So then you're admitting that you happily use Keynesian theory when it suits you but suddenly it's been completely disproven when it says something you don't like?
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2017  Hobbyist Digital Artist
It's a very simple question.  If you're arguing that Keynes was wrong and that demand isn't the limiting factor on the economy, then why in the world would tax cuts stimulate the economy?  The point of tax cuts as stimulus is that they put more money in people's pockets which they can spend and increase demand.  That is the basis of Keynesian theory.

If you can't answer such an obvious question, how do you get off making comments about using people's logic to debunk their logic?
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:iconkessy-athena:
kessy-athena Featured By Owner Dec 26, 2017  Hobbyist Digital Artist
So if Keynesian economics is wrong, why would tax cuts stimulate the economy?
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:iconstephdumas:
stephdumas Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2017
And let's be sure some will spend the money at the right place as shown in this editorial toon. imgur.com/a/pFSZH
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:iconartizdak:
Artizdak Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2017
Ok, even a broken orange clock with an awesome hairdo is right twice a day. Let's go tax cuts! Let's follow it up with another tax cut!
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:iconmenapia:
menapia Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2017
Ah heck people have always argued about the effectiveness of taxation, there's even a bit in the old testament banging on about it - we've had taxes on everything, windows, fireplaces the friggin Romans had a tax on piss.

Considering two taxes are being used to deal with the screw ups caused by private businesses here i.e. the levy on insurance because one major co. buggered up, and the Property tax which was brought in since our govt. generously paid off the debts of those banks that really screwed up
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:icongraeystone:
Graeystone Featured By Owner Dec 23, 2017
OT Taxes = 10% which went straight to God who put such things to better use than some earthly politician.
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:iconmenapia:
menapia Featured By Owner Dec 23, 2017
Or St. Peter's Pence the medieval tax for the Church - when the Pope "gave" Ireland to Henry II of England part of the deal was that our ancestors had to pay a tax to IL Papa
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:iconbcrbuio3tvrbvt:
bcrbuio3tvrbvt Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2017
Keynesian economics is just a fallacious doctrine being used as an excuse to try and rob the rich in finding a way to force them to spend their money whether they like it or not.
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:icongraeystone:
Graeystone Featured By Owner Dec 23, 2017
Its also a way to stir up division and even violence like what happened with Russia because of what Lenin said and did.
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