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By 4-X-S
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© 2017 - 2021 4-X-S
anonymous's avatar
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Daemoria's avatar
What happened to the description of this image? Seems like I missed something, based on the comments down here.

I really quite like this design, and the surface details are so readable! I could just make a 3d mesh so easily with this image. (I wont, 'cause its a commission image)

Really like the engine array as well.
4-X-S's avatar
I will talk to the one who ordered the commission, it is likely you will have his permission. I usually just type some random place holder in places of description.
Daemoria's avatar
No need to talk to the client. I just was making an observation on how clean the design was.
4-X-S's avatar
Ok have fun look around.
cman1o1dalek's avatar
The Daleks Have constructed Space stations out of moons...
4-X-S's avatar
Are they hive mind?
cman1o1dalek's avatar
We have Emperors or Supreme Daleks 
ulimann644's avatar
4-X-S's avatar
haha great :la:
HyaKkiDouR4n's avatar
Size of a peninsula?!!
Gee, I guess that it's never big enough for the people who are into that sort of thing (bad innuendo intended)...

It's well made but nothing special either. Nothing strikes as unusual or "new" in this design, but it works.
4-X-S's avatar
The size was decided by the one ordered this commission, personally I would prefer it to be much smaller, like size of Chicago or something. It should't be something new, I put a lot effort to develop the less new style XD
HyaKkiDouR4n's avatar
So being effective and familiar at the expense of some originality is actually a goal of yours?
People praise originality a lot, so this question might sound rude, but it's really not : making concepts easier to understand by being more familiar/classic can be a perfectly valid and noble design philosophy.
Pheasant-One's avatar
There's nothing original under the sun.
Your question is soo oddly formatted, is not being "Orginal" a bad thing? If that's the case then there a lot of people out there in the world that
needs questioning. I'm not really sure what's the point of your comment. 

If you're saying we're ripping off Star Wars. I'd like to point out that a lot of people accused Star Wars of ripping off many things before it. 
So it's a moot point.
HyaKkiDouR4n's avatar
Well, this debate is an old one, and the problem is that evryone actually has a slightly different definition of what "original" is and it creates pointless fights (extreme example : the Sonic OC community). I usually don't explain my position in detail right from the start because it takes time, but when things turn this direction I guess I have to to clarify things.

Yes, 100% new doesn't exist. But the key word in this sentence isn't actually "new", but rather "100%".
Each creation has, dare I say it this way, a "percentage of new" in it. And when I say that something is "original", I mean that this percentage is higher than usual.

An example? 4-X-S drew another space ships recently which had gigantic metal girders on the outside, in a shape I never seen before. While I wondered what those girders did on a functional standpoint, they made the ship look a bit more unusual and "new" than a ship like the one here.

Maybe this is only going from "10% original" to "15% original", but considering how hard it is to gain on a point on this scale, this actually makes a noticeable difference.

And of course : appreciation of this percentage of originality will always be subjective. With those comments I tried to explain why this ship felt less original to me that others of 4-X-S designs. Plus, as I said, drawing "10% original" but with a higher level of mastery can be a perfectly noble goal as an artist.

When I was a kid, I was quite into an old PC game franchise called "INCA". This is about some reality where the Incan empire spans the galaxy, which mixes science fiction with precolombian esthetics in a very unusual fashion. This was quite new, especially in 1992.
Of course, this isn't "100% new", since it is based on Incan esthetics, which existed before, and mixes it all with classic science fiction. But despite this, it is undeniable that this game has a very strong identity. You can like it or not, but it is undeniable that it is more "original", as in : the percentage of new ideas and unusual combinations is higher than normal, resulting in a more unique universe.

Hope that clarifies things. I'll agree this position is subjective, but hopefully it's the kind of subjective built on analysis and some arguments, so I wouldn't call it a moot point.

If for you "original" means "100% new", you can stick with that definition. But that's not what it means to me and hopefully it is clear to you now.
4-X-S's avatar
Hollow frame space ship is older than any of us Granny they are been shown more on SF insert pages than on screen. Is because they are often less immersive than solid designs. Those bars extend out are similar to death star under constriction, only in this case is never meant to have a stead state of completeness, they are instead for convenient attachment of foreign objects, to make them form an uninformed geometry with the rest of ship, that would maintain a fixed gravitational center, while better at avoiding collection.
HyaKkiDouR4n's avatar
Makes sense.
You're right on this technically being old : since early days of space explorations, some authors cared about realism, and realism implies optimization of mass. An hollow structure is a way to achieve it.
But despite this old origin, the "girder ship" looked slightly more "new" to me than this one. But as I said in my big comment : there is a subjective aspect in evaluating "originality".
Of course, one can eliminate a lot of this subjectivity by being very knowledgeable in a design field (here, SF). But the thing is, I am NOT a massive SF guy. I am nerdy enough to know the big franchises, but I wouldn't know much about obscure SF stuff (except maybe that INCA game I happened to get kinda randomly XD)
Pheasant-One's avatar
You mean this?
20MinConceptOFSpaceshipsizeofPeninsula by 4-X-S

Yea, I even told you that was just a draft.
There's also another saying too, just because something is original, doesn't mean its good. And what 4-X-S does is pretty good at what he does. Why fix something that isn't broken?

And like I told you before, those gaps between the "struts" were supposed to be filled.
I specifically told the artist I want the ship to be "Inspired" by the Star Destroyer, but with different features that wouldn't make my SD look like an outright rip-off. Even if we had our disagreements, I got what I wanted.
I really enjoyed this latest draft, 4-X-S added more to my idea, coming up with a design that I myself couldn't imagine. In my view, is a good blend of Homeworld and Star Wars (Which Homeworld was inspired by Star Wars).

The ship itself is supposed to be in the universe of the story I'm writing:
HyaKkiDouR4n's avatar
Well, apparently I didn't properly get it through : his drawing isn't "broken" or "bad". I said it myself : less originality but more mastery of trustworthy, familiar concepts is a perfectly fine design philosophy.
Somehow when I say this, people always react like I implied the drawing is bad. I never said that! You just can't have it both ways : the two design directions are opposed, and producing a design means choosing a position between those two extremes.

Maybe our society talks so much about originality being important that people have an automatic offended reaction when you just state that they weren't very original in a piece of art. But the thing is, originality is just a criteria amongst many. What this picture lacks in that department, it more than makes up in others. It's a good design. Good, but not very original. XD

Anyways, good luck with your SF story.
Pheasant-One's avatar
I think I see what you mean.

Personally, I think the design is pretty original in some form, the only thing I can say that's truly different about the design is the fact its 1,800 km large.
Which I've failed to see any other Scifi (Asides from Independence Day (I'm looking at you Resurgence!)) try to do. But then again, you kinda have to take the title's word to heart.
I'd rather have something boxy and boring than something technicolored and stupid. I've seen so many people try to be original but they all end up having their art look
like complete lunacy. Again, original doesn't always equal good.

I think the originality comes from the context of the ship, not visually.
There's a good reason for its boring design as in I'm trying to be as scientificity accurate and at the same time try to be as fantastical as humanly possible. The ship is a 
symbol of how advance and pompous two of the story's empires is. You couldn't get this bad boy close to a planet unless you wanted to create an earth-shattering atrocity.
Just by simply parking this baby next to our earth's atmosphere, you could kill millions of people through weather changes, rising tides and tsunamis because the gravity and mass
of this thing are properly fucked beyond reason. It would make the Imperium of Man's exterminatus look like a water pistol with less effort on the ship's part. It also makes a good
bargaining chip in Alien diplomacy, "Give us what we want or We'll just chill next to your planet!". Or you can just crash the ship into said planet and recreate the extinction of the dinosaurs
all over again.

This show's the testament of Earth's Empire. And the fact that said Empire is controlled by a literal god that would make the God-Emperor of mankind look like an ant.  
No offense to Warhammer 40k, I love it as much as the next person, but you could make a good argument that I'm ripping off 40K, but to be fair I'm more inspired by the Foundation series, Dune, 
and real life history.  Taking out things I didn't like about those stories and taking inspiration from things I did like. And to hammer in the point, you could make the argument that 40k just ripped offed a ton of Scifi books, movies, games, etc to create its own world. If that was true, Games Workshop would have a good reason for this, its because they weren't trying to be original as much they were trying to make a fun and interesting universe to play your tabletop games in with your friends (And they did that job very well). 

And thanks wishing me luck, god knows I need some to fight my own procrastination.
I'd be cool if you would come over and give it a critic if you got the time :) (Smile) 
Even if there isn't much as of now.
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4-X-S's avatar
LOL Im glad you like the ship, I guess originality works in mysterious ways. Absolut Deviant! 
Pheasant-One's avatar
I'll have to save the old draft for something new in the future.
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4-X-S's avatar
The result looks original to me, :-? (Confused) I don;t know what originality are you referring to. Granny Maybe part of this was to compensate the commission requirements XD I guess originality can be subjective.
HyaKkiDouR4n's avatar
I used "original" in the "unusual" sense of the term, but maybe I shouldn't have, since you apparently understood that I was blaming you of ripping off an existing design.
I guess it's my bad. What I meant is : this ship has a new design, but this design is pretty classic, with no crazy, unusual idea. Classic is effective and not that easy to master, though, so don't take it as an insult!
anonymous's avatar
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